Binary Order Interview
Q: Can you talk about your history as an artist?
A: When I started taking a more active interest in music at around 14 or 15 I struggled in bands, I always wanted to write my own songs while everyone I knew was focusing more on covers. So I’ve always had that in me to write, but it wasn’t until the late 2000s when Binary Order actually started. It was originally a project between myself and my brother and at the time he was incredibly skilled at songwriting and production whereas I just knew what I wanted to make and had no way to actually do it. Back then Binary Order sounded nothing like it does now – it was 100% electronic - but it had the same name and tone.
Eventually, we disbanded because he wanted to make a completely different sound to me (he currently writes under the name Freqfox) but I kept the name we were using and spent the next few years (or next decade depending on how you look at it) sort of figuring out how to actually write music, produce and sing. It’s been a very, very long process but where I’ve got to on Dunes is exactly the kind of music I always dreamed of making so it’s great to have the skills in both production and performance to be able to achieve that now.
Q: Are there specific influences musical or otherwise that inspires your music?
A: Growing up I was really into the music I was hearing in video games and it ended up being a huge influence on me. Games like Ecco the Dolphin, Streets of Rage and of course the Sonic series are the very first memories of music I remember connecting with. In retrospect there was a lot of friction towards that, even as a child I was being told “this isn’t real music, Ben. Here you should be playing Three Blind Mice on the xylophone.” Unfortunately, that elitism when it comes to music never really went away from the people I met throughout my life, but it only ever made me double down on my own passions, instead of pretending to like something I didn’t – I don’t believe in “guilty pleasures” for that reason.
As I got older, I was lucky enough that nu-metal was huge in popular culture as I turned 13 so I didn’t have to look far for rock and alternative music. Bands like Papa Roach, Linkin Park, Limp Bizkit etc. were huge for me. But I always wanted to combine the love of electronic from video game music with that intensity I was hearing in rock and metal music… which eventually led me to industrial metal and more specifically; Nine Inch Nails. Who has undoubtedly been the biggest influence on what I’m doing now with Binary Order, in terms of the actual fundamentals.
Outside of that I’m hugely influenced by bands and artists like HEALTH, Thrice, Lorn, Emma Ruth Rundle, This Will Destroy You to name a few. I also find myself listening to a lot of movie soundtracks just because there’s an atmosphere in that stuff you can’t find anywhere else, which has a conscious influence a lot of the more soundscape/instrumental aspects of what I do with Binary Order.
Q: What is your recording process like for Dunes?
A: Difficult.
For the past five years I’ve been writing an album a year. I’ll usually start in the winter with demos/ideas and build those over the next few months. Then into the summer I’ll start recording/producing. Because of my stupid system I usually end up recording vocals during the hottest part of the year; which has been… not great.
On the last album I got into a pretty good system in terms of what tones and tech I was going to use. So going into Dunes I had the base for how a lot of stuff was going to sound and on Dunes it was about building that up to the next level. So it allowed me to skip the experimentation aspect to a degree on focus on better sounding instruments, better production, better performance etc.
Outside of that, towards the end of the recording process I started experimenting with hardware synths for the first time. I really got into Dreadbox stuff (the Nyx and Typhon specifically), which feature on Dunes a fair bit.
Q: Can you talk about your history as an artist?
A: When I started taking a more active interest in music at around 14 or 15 I struggled in bands, I always wanted to write my own songs while everyone I knew was focusing more on covers. So I’ve always had that in me to write, but it wasn’t until the late 2000s when Binary Order actually started. It was originally a project between myself and my brother and at the time he was incredibly skilled at songwriting and production whereas I just knew what I wanted to make and had no way to actually do it. Back then Binary Order sounded nothing like it does now – it was 100% electronic - but it had the same name and tone.
Eventually, we disbanded because he wanted to make a completely different sound to me (he currently writes under the name Freqfox) but I kept the name we were using and spent the next few years (or next decade depending on how you look at it) sort of figuring out how to actually write music, produce and sing. It’s been a very, very long process but where I’ve got to on Dunes is exactly the kind of music I always dreamed of making so it’s great to have the skills in both production and performance to be able to achieve that now.
Q: Are there specific influences musical or otherwise that inspires your music?
A: Growing up I was really into the music I was hearing in video games and it ended up being a huge influence on me. Games like Ecco the Dolphin, Streets of Rage and of course the Sonic series are the very first memories of music I remember connecting with. In retrospect there was a lot of friction towards that, even as a child I was being told “this isn’t real music, Ben. Here you should be playing Three Blind Mice on the xylophone.” Unfortunately, that elitism when it comes to music never really went away from the people I met throughout my life, but it only ever made me double down on my own passions, instead of pretending to like something I didn’t – I don’t believe in “guilty pleasures” for that reason.
As I got older, I was lucky enough that nu-metal was huge in popular culture as I turned 13 so I didn’t have to look far for rock and alternative music. Bands like Papa Roach, Linkin Park, Limp Bizkit etc. were huge for me. But I always wanted to combine the love of electronic from video game music with that intensity I was hearing in rock and metal music… which eventually led me to industrial metal and more specifically; Nine Inch Nails. Who has undoubtedly been the biggest influence on what I’m doing now with Binary Order, in terms of the actual fundamentals.
Outside of that I’m hugely influenced by bands and artists like HEALTH, Thrice, Lorn, Emma Ruth Rundle, This Will Destroy You to name a few. I also find myself listening to a lot of movie soundtracks just because there’s an atmosphere in that stuff you can’t find anywhere else, which has a conscious influence a lot of the more soundscape/instrumental aspects of what I do with Binary Order.
Q: What is your recording process like for Dunes?
A: Difficult.
For the past five years I’ve been writing an album a year. I’ll usually start in the winter with demos/ideas and build those over the next few months. Then into the summer I’ll start recording/producing. Because of my stupid system I usually end up recording vocals during the hottest part of the year; which has been… not great.
On the last album I got into a pretty good system in terms of what tones and tech I was going to use. So going into Dunes I had the base for how a lot of stuff was going to sound and on Dunes it was about building that up to the next level. So it allowed me to skip the experimentation aspect to a degree on focus on better sounding instruments, better production, better performance etc.
Outside of that, towards the end of the recording process I started experimenting with hardware synths for the first time. I really got into Dreadbox stuff (the Nyx and Typhon specifically), which feature on Dunes a fair bit.
Q: What is your creative process like?
A: With Dunes the biggest thing for me was to really nail down my screams, as on the previous two albums I had used false chords and wanted to go back to fry vocals. Unfortunately the way I was doing fry was just shredding my voice (which is why I changed to false in the first place) so I had to spend a few months learning how to scream properly. I think the results are incredible, although my flatmate had to endure hearing me make animals like noises intermittently throughout the day for a few months.
Along with that I really wanted to push on more of the guitar side of what I’ve done with Binary. Build songs that had actual riffs and really develop the more metal side of what I’m doing. Tracks like “Roads,” “Flood,” “Anchor” etc. are some of the results of this and it was a process of taking myself out of my comfort zone and really focusing on that element.
I think together with the screams it’s created my most intense release – which is great. I want it to sound like as painful to listen to as it was to live through.
Each album I’ve made so far I’m trying to etch out what my sound is and with Dunes it’s the first release that I really think starts to pinpoint what that is. Songs like “Beautiful” are truly an accumulation of years of work to walk that line between electronic, metal, intense and melodic. I think in terms of what the Binary Order sound is” Beautiful” is the best example of that.
Q: What are some of the themes that are touched upon your release Dunes?
A: As I write an album each year they’ve become a snapshot of where I am in my life. With Dunes there was no set theme to begin with and I was just expressing where I was at that point in my life. I actually struggled to come up with a title for the album for a long while because of this.
When I started writing Dunes the pandemic was in full swing, it was around winter 2020 and the UK was facing that Christmas in lockdown. For me it was really expressing the isolation I had gone through till that point and was continuing to endure. I was single then and had been for a fair while - and most of my social interaction was through dating apps of all things. It led to a plethora of frustration and disappointment from dealing with people’s expectations of me and my own expectations of what I want from life, which really caused me to turn into myself. Aside from my flatmate I had no one to turn to and I experienced some of the most intense loneliness I had ever gone through.
So I ended up delving into my own failings and what exactly had caused me to get to this point, and observing how my decisions had led me to become so abandoned and hopeless. Surrounded by people that I couldn’t reach out to, people that didn’t care and people I didn’t even want to be around.
I really had created my own hell and was in the midst of realizing this as I wrote Dunes. I felt like I was lost and cripplingly alone, which led to the title Dunes. The symbolism of being lost in a desert surrounded by dunes seemed apt to where I was at that point in my life. Add to that I’m also using a fragmented pyramid as the Binary Order logo I think it came together perfectly.
Q: Have you started playing shows or virtual shows?
A: I have not. Binary Order is just me (with the input of my flatmate on piano and production) so there’s no band so to speak to play live. It’s something I am interested in but I’ve struggled with finding musicians with the same passion, so I’ve focused on the studio space.
I have had ideas to put out live studio performances of the songs but we’ll see.
Q: What else should we know about your music?
I’m already deep into the follow up to Dunes so there’s more music coming. And I’m also working on a project with a friend which is being kept quiet for now so there’s a lot more to come in the next year hopefully. Musically I just want to stay active and constantly creating no matter what the avenue is, I’ve been doing this whole Binary Order thing when it was incredibly detrimental to be doing so and I can’t fathom how I’d stop now. Whoever decides to listen to what I’m making I’m incredibly grateful that they do, but even if no one does I’m not stopping.
A: With Dunes the biggest thing for me was to really nail down my screams, as on the previous two albums I had used false chords and wanted to go back to fry vocals. Unfortunately the way I was doing fry was just shredding my voice (which is why I changed to false in the first place) so I had to spend a few months learning how to scream properly. I think the results are incredible, although my flatmate had to endure hearing me make animals like noises intermittently throughout the day for a few months.
Along with that I really wanted to push on more of the guitar side of what I’ve done with Binary. Build songs that had actual riffs and really develop the more metal side of what I’m doing. Tracks like “Roads,” “Flood,” “Anchor” etc. are some of the results of this and it was a process of taking myself out of my comfort zone and really focusing on that element.
I think together with the screams it’s created my most intense release – which is great. I want it to sound like as painful to listen to as it was to live through.
Each album I’ve made so far I’m trying to etch out what my sound is and with Dunes it’s the first release that I really think starts to pinpoint what that is. Songs like “Beautiful” are truly an accumulation of years of work to walk that line between electronic, metal, intense and melodic. I think in terms of what the Binary Order sound is” Beautiful” is the best example of that.
Q: What are some of the themes that are touched upon your release Dunes?
A: As I write an album each year they’ve become a snapshot of where I am in my life. With Dunes there was no set theme to begin with and I was just expressing where I was at that point in my life. I actually struggled to come up with a title for the album for a long while because of this.
When I started writing Dunes the pandemic was in full swing, it was around winter 2020 and the UK was facing that Christmas in lockdown. For me it was really expressing the isolation I had gone through till that point and was continuing to endure. I was single then and had been for a fair while - and most of my social interaction was through dating apps of all things. It led to a plethora of frustration and disappointment from dealing with people’s expectations of me and my own expectations of what I want from life, which really caused me to turn into myself. Aside from my flatmate I had no one to turn to and I experienced some of the most intense loneliness I had ever gone through.
So I ended up delving into my own failings and what exactly had caused me to get to this point, and observing how my decisions had led me to become so abandoned and hopeless. Surrounded by people that I couldn’t reach out to, people that didn’t care and people I didn’t even want to be around.
I really had created my own hell and was in the midst of realizing this as I wrote Dunes. I felt like I was lost and cripplingly alone, which led to the title Dunes. The symbolism of being lost in a desert surrounded by dunes seemed apt to where I was at that point in my life. Add to that I’m also using a fragmented pyramid as the Binary Order logo I think it came together perfectly.
Q: Have you started playing shows or virtual shows?
A: I have not. Binary Order is just me (with the input of my flatmate on piano and production) so there’s no band so to speak to play live. It’s something I am interested in but I’ve struggled with finding musicians with the same passion, so I’ve focused on the studio space.
I have had ideas to put out live studio performances of the songs but we’ll see.
Q: What else should we know about your music?
I’m already deep into the follow up to Dunes so there’s more music coming. And I’m also working on a project with a friend which is being kept quiet for now so there’s a lot more to come in the next year hopefully. Musically I just want to stay active and constantly creating no matter what the avenue is, I’ve been doing this whole Binary Order thing when it was incredibly detrimental to be doing so and I can’t fathom how I’d stop now. Whoever decides to listen to what I’m making I’m incredibly grateful that they do, but even if no one does I’m not stopping.